Page 10 of 10 FirstFirst ... 8910
Results 136 to 150 of 150
  1. #136
    Join Date
    Feb 2018
    Location
    Chattanooga TN
    Posts
    61
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by Renfrick1 View Post
    Gen 3 Hemi Camshaft Failure Mystery Explained! - YouTube
    Here’s a video there’s a design flaw


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

    Flat Earth PROVEN By Independent Research - YouTube

    Here is a video, the earth is flat.



    Get the point?

    Cause that video already been hashed over. Read the thread. Can not base an "fact" using an older engine with a much newer ones. And he leaves out a lot of details. Not to mention early GEN III are known to not have anywhere the same amount of failed lifters vs the 2009+ Eagle hemis and he is clearly using a Pre Eagle hemi block.

    Crank splash lubrication defect argument holds as much water as MDS Lifters being the cause of it argument.
    2011 Dodge Charger Pursuit 113K Miles. Stock for Now.
    Cop Brakes, Cop Exhaust, Cop Suspension,
    It's the model with the big bull bar so pedestrians get out of the way.

    Likes Hemissary liked this post

  2. #137
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Posts
    1,380
    Post Thanks / Like
    Yeah I guess your right
    There’s nothing wrong with the design
    Your right.
    Is that what you wanna hear


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  3. #138
    Join Date
    Feb 2018
    Location
    Chattanooga TN
    Posts
    61
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by Renfrick1 View Post
    Yeah I guess your right
    There’s nothing wrong with the design
    Your right.
    Is that what you wanna hear


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    Keep going back to design issues. How about trying to connect some dots your self? Perhaps if you can not come up with logical ideas that is not based on youtube clickbait monetized channels then you should have never posted in this thread.


    Let em question this. If it were a 100% design issue. Then why hasn't every single hemi failed in the same manner withing same miles? Of all the million or so hemis produced, why is the general failure rate statistically low (failed vs in service)


    If splash lubrication is so important, then why is my 3.3 designed by dodge, have much more of it's cam covered by the casting than the hemi generally last 200+ miles even with rough ownership? Would you like photos of this? I have a bare block?
    2011 Dodge Charger Pursuit 113K Miles. Stock for Now.
    Cop Brakes, Cop Exhaust, Cop Suspension,
    It's the model with the big bull bar so pedestrians get out of the way.


  4. #139
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Posts
    1,380
    Post Thanks / Like
    Your right it’s not a design flaw. Everyone drives there cars the same. So it can’t be. Based on the amount of known cases that we read on the forums and the true amount of failures which we actually don’t no. Your right it’s not a design flaw.
    Your right. Your absolutely right. It’s not a design flaw. It’s gotta be something else, just not a design flaw.



    Oh and by the way I just spoke with both of my mechanics and they agree. It’s a design flaw they said the worst thing you can do is idle a lot and low rpm driving

    But your right it’s Not a design flaw


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  5. #140
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Posts
    1,380
    Post Thanks / Like
    I should also add that if it’s not a design flaw it’s the way they designed it. Which may or may not make sense to you.
    Being a mechanic my self in a different field I see this every day.
    And my statement is
    “ if they made something that would last forever( and they could)
    How many would they make, and what would happen to there stock price?


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  6. #141
    Join Date
    Mar 2017
    Location
    Bedford, Texas
    Posts
    4,622
    Post Thanks / Like
    If it was IN the design, thereby making it a flawed design, every engine made would have the problem. They do not.

    What is so hard to comprehend about the amount of failures vs. the amount of untroubled engines is so difficult? There are literally millions more untroubled engines than there are failures.

    There is not enough complete data to determine the cause, period. Anything we do is conjecture at this point.


    It could be something as simple as one dull/ damaged bit on one machine. Someone could have been playing grab ass instead of actually DOING their QC checks. A post machine rinsing station not pumping enough fluid to properly rinse out the shavings.

    I know of a guy (not me BTW) that worked for Chevy on the cam QC line. Dude fell asleep for his whole shift. Hundreds of cams went by him and not a single one was checked for hours. Not long after, there was a sht storm of Chevy small block cam failures and some here might be old enough to remember that. Coincidence? No one ever proved it, but the timing was uncanny.

    There are so many things it COULD be, but a design flaw or a flaw in the design isn't one of them.

    Sent from my moto z4 using Tapatalk
    Likes Hemissary, GTSDart340 liked this post

  7. #142
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Posts
    1,380
    Post Thanks / Like
    So let me ask then, how many have failed ? Does anyone know? Or are you just speculating that it’s a fraction of what they made. What’s the cutoff number ? 20% before you consider it a flaw in design
    Personally I think it’s a higher number then you think.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  8. #143
    Join Date
    Mar 2017
    Location
    Bedford, Texas
    Posts
    4,622
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by Renfrick1 View Post
    So let me ask then, how many have failed ? Does anyone know? Or are you just speculating that it’s a fraction of what they made. What’s the cutoff number ? 20% before you consider it a flaw in design
    Personally I think it’s a higher number then you think.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    Obviously it's a fraction of what they made.

    What part of, "If it was a design flaw, they would all have the issue" don't you get?

    You also (obviously) missed the 3rd paragraph of my post. We do not have enough information. The amount of failures is part of that information.

    The internet is notorious for blowing things out of proportion. Here, we have a very small (miniscule) number of owners. When 5 people out of 100 have a problem, it seems much more of a problem than when say 100 out of 10,000 in the real world have it.

    Sent from my moto z4 using Tapatalk

  9. #144
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    Calgary, Alberta
    Posts
    15,280
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by Renfrick1 View Post
    Well I’m no dummy. Ive been on here since 09 and have seen so many cam and lifter gone bad threads, valve seat dropped topics I could puke. If you guys think there’s nothing wrong with the design of our hemis you can stay hidden behind that rock.
    Maddog is right and thank you for your fight on this
    Simon you’ve brought a lot of knowledge to the board but I’ll bet in real life your an engineer,or have some type of engineer back ground. Your very smart. Am I right??
    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

    You would do well to actually read the thread. I've been on here longer than you, I haven't seen "all these lifter threads" you claim to have read on here. So post them.

    When you DO read this thread, you'll likely come to the same conclusions the rest of us did. The OP:
    - Is about to install a fourth(!) set of lifters / cam - into the same block
    - Bullsh!tted through his teeth about "millions of lifter failures"
    - Then retracted the statement - but went on the bullsh!t run again and again
    - Refused(!) to listen and acknowledge any of our contributions
    - When bullsh!t failed he resorted to insults and marginalizing not just us - but every Member on this Forum.

    As to my learned background; are you very smart? WTF does this have to do with the price of tea? Clearly - your goal in this thread is to marginalize.

    Instead, like most on here do, f'n read what I write and use critical thought, critical reasoning and - if needed - confer with others who actually(!) know their sh!t. It should go without saying; if someone can show where I'm in error / wrong, I'll be the first person to acknowledge and - if needed - apologize.

    So...where am I wrong in this thread please. You better have real facts...not innuendo as we kept reading over and over in this thread.



    Last edited by Hemissary; 07-25-2020 at 10:10 PM.
    2005 Magnum RT---Viper Venom Red----440ci Aluminum block----Short Runner Valve Intake--410mm BAER 6S Monoblock Extreme--Eibach Multi-Pro 2

    Custom--Grille Work--Hood--Headlights--Side View Mirrors--Rear Spoiler--Rear Diffuser--SRV Control System--Turbine Wheels

    Likes GTSDart340 liked this post

  10. #145
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    Calgary, Alberta
    Posts
    15,280
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by CE9311 View Post
    Argument stems from the cause. Everyone knows something is wrong. But you have to everything agree that matches the failure. If there are three data points, and your argument is only supported by one does not mean it is the final say so. That is my whole beef. There is a lot of missing information that we will never get a hold of that could help. I.E. Say wanted to explore casting defect in a specific year range of block production...You would need numbers off couple hundred failed lifter blocks to get a control group to start a statistical fact on it. Same with Lifter being blamed. You would need to be be able to trace the supplier, and use of them through out the several vehicles they were used in.

    I do not feel I ever said what is causing it, just argued against what others say cause it without having the actual data across the board to properly prove it.


    And if you think new engines rely so heavily on "crank splash Lubrication" then you def have been hiding behind a rock for some time. possibly since the 1940s ish.




    And coming on to the thread, offering nothing at all towards a discussion / argument besides calling some "know it alls", and acting like your horse is that much higher, then your def no better than at other garden variety troll. In fact by doing so you are belittling, and marginalizing others yourself. Ain't that funny?


    Regardless of my disagreement with some folks here I would rather have them here than some one who does not offer nothing towards the actual topic vs just their personal judgment of the parties involved.

    I don't recall you pointing a / any smoking gun either. I know I didn't. We've touched on potential root causes (in no particular order):
    - Poor machining (passage registering); namely the passageways for either top-down or side oil supply
    - Passageway blockages (poor QC)
    - Materials issue; given just how many there are, the individual roller integrity (proper base materials, heat treat / quench processes)

    Quote Originally Posted by Renfrick1 View Post
    Gen 3 Hemi Camshaft Failure Mystery Explained! - YouTube
    Here’s a video there’s a design flaw Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

    Old school thinking being applied to modern engine design. Have you looked at a / any Hemi casting - specifically access to the voids (or lack thereof) between the crank and the camshaft?? Do that - get back to us.


    Quote Originally Posted by Renfrick1 View Post
    Yeah I guess your right
    There’s nothing wrong with the design
    Your right.
    Is that what you wanna hear Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    Flippant - unproductive.

    Quote Originally Posted by CE9311 View Post
    Keep going back to design issues. How about trying to connect some dots your self? Perhaps if you can not come up with logical ideas that is not based on youtube clickbait monetized channels then you should have never posted in this thread. Let em question this. If it were a 100% design issue. Then why hasn't every single hemi failed in the same manner withing same miles? Of all the million or so hemis produced, why is the general failure rate statistically low (failed vs in service)

    If splash lubrication is so important, then why is my 3.3 designed by dodge, have much more of it's cam covered by the casting than the hemi generally last 200+ miles even with rough ownership? Would you like photos of this? I have a bare block?
    Hear hear :^)

    Quote Originally Posted by Renfrick1 View Post
    Your right it’s not a design flaw. Everyone drives there cars the same. So it can’t be. Based on the amount of known cases that we read on the forums and the true amount of failures which we actually don’t no. Your right it’s not a design flaw.
    Your right. Your absolutely right. It’s not a design flaw. It’s gotta be something else, just not a design flaw.

    Oh and by the way I just spoke with both of my mechanics and they agree. It’s a design flaw they said the worst thing you can do is idle a lot and low rpm driving

    But your right it’s Not a design flaw Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    Quote Originally Posted by Renfrick1 View Post
    I should also add that if it’s not a design flaw it’s the way they designed it. Which may or may not make sense to you.
    Being a mechanic my self in a different field I see this every day.
    And my statement is
    “ if they made something that would last forever( and they could)
    How many would they make, and what would happen to there stock price?
    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    Do you think Engineers, Managers and bean counters sit around devising ways and means for planned obsolescence? What kind of job that would be for Type A Engineers...to gauge / ensure failure :^(

    I agree regarding the term design flaw versus QC / product consistency. For example, it is possible the lifter operating angle (Shallow) could be a design flaw. Still - the lifter is not the root failure. Batches of blocks that were not machined correctly and starve, for example the #5 lifter assemblies, is a QC issue. Another design issue could be a marked drop in dynamic operating pressure due directly(!) to oil galleys that are upstream --> downstream (resulting pressure drop is worse for certain lifters). I have no expectation of an FCA employee admitting to me; "yes - we've determined cylinders x, x, and x operate at a consistently lower dynamic pressure - which is still above the required threshold to maintain proper valve lash, but during extended hot-idle can begin to starve the roller needle bearings" ;^)

    Quote Originally Posted by Renfrick1 View Post
    So let me ask then, how many have failed ? Does anyone know? Or are you just speculating that it’s a fraction of what they made. What’s the cutoff number ? 20% before you consider it a flaw in design
    Personally I think it’s a higher number then you think. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    The OP promised - his numbers are above reproach - in the millions! I talked to Techs across four local Dealerships, along with others I know in-industry; they laughed at the "millions" of failures. To date - zero evidence has been put forth. As to a class action lawsuit getting off the ground - in any way shape or form, I have a significantly better chance of becoming the all-round "nice guy" that everyone just loooves and adores on here :^)

    Quote Originally Posted by punisher69 View Post
    Obviously it's a fraction of what they made.

    What part of, "If it was a design flaw, they would all have the issue" don't you get?

    You also (obviously) missed the 3rd paragraph of my post. We do not have enough information. The amount of failures is part of that information.

    The internet is notorious for blowing things out of proportion. Here, we have a very small (miniscule) number of owners. When 5 people out of 100 have a problem, it seems much more of a problem than when say 100 out of 10,000 in the real world have it.

    Sent from my moto z4 using Tapatalk
    ​Hear hear...
    Last edited by Hemissary; 07-26-2020 at 12:04 PM.
    2005 Magnum RT---Viper Venom Red----440ci Aluminum block----Short Runner Valve Intake--410mm BAER 6S Monoblock Extreme--Eibach Multi-Pro 2

    Custom--Grille Work--Hood--Headlights--Side View Mirrors--Rear Spoiler--Rear Diffuser--SRV Control System--Turbine Wheels

    Likes GTSDart340 liked this post

  11. #146
    Join Date
    Feb 2018
    Location
    Chattanooga TN
    Posts
    61
    Post Thanks / Like
    Here is a undershot of a Chrysler Designed 3.3 I keep at the foot of my bed. Gonna go ahead and say must be a miracle of all these engines rely on crank splash lubrication and this baby looks like its gets as much splash as the Sahara gets rain and yet, still has never been widely known for lifter/roller failures due to idling or low rpm use. Like to also point the engine with improvements over time, including use in a racing platform by Shelby (Can Am series) was in production for nearly 30 years.



    And even then, I would say this argument is not valid, in a discussion involving a completely different engine. I would only use it to show that really old school thinking needs to stay where it belongs. With old School stuff.
    2011 Dodge Charger Pursuit 113K Miles. Stock for Now.
    Cop Brakes, Cop Exhaust, Cop Suspension,
    It's the model with the big bull bar so pedestrians get out of the way.


  12. #147
    Join Date
    Jul 2020
    Posts
    6
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by Myckee View Post
    Unfortunately the moderators just let this place run wild with a few "know it all's" who troll the forum and belittle and marginalize anyone who has a differing opinion than themselves. This thread is a perfect example where the OP has been harassed and belittled and the moderators don't give a damn. It's too bad, there is a lot of really good information on this forum, and the majority of the people here are great, but a few bad actors really taint the place with an ugly aura.
    Your 100% correct
    I made two or three posts and already have 3 or 4 people my on ignore list! I am on Many different forums and NEVER had to do this!
    They make NO clear argument with any supportive proof of anything!
    They wanna argue a point with no evidence OR just Parrot what they read on other web sights or go by what others say on other web sights Reviews PARROTING.

    At least Yellow Bullet and Speed talk all are all Professionals, There they listen and make suggestions from experience!
    people who talk smack or don't know what they are talking about are quickly put in there place!

    Just Me But I would rather get advise from a Guy with a wall full of Wally's Or a Guy who Owns a Full blown Machine shop than some Key Board commandos on some web forum.
    Last edited by Dudly; 07-26-2020 at 10:40 AM.

  13. #148
    Join Date
    Feb 2018
    Location
    Chattanooga TN
    Posts
    61
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by Dudly View Post
    Your 100% correct
    I made two or three posts and already have 3 or 4 people my on ignore list! I am on Many different forums and NEVER had to do this!
    They make NO clear argument with any supportive proof of anything!
    They wanna argue a point with no evidence OR just Parrot what they read on other web sights or go by what others say on other web sights Reviews PARROTING.

    At least Yellow Bullet and Speed talk all are all Professionals, There they listen and make suggestions from experience!
    people who talk smack or don't know what they are talking about are quickly put in there place!

    Just Me But I would rather get advise from a Guy with a wall full of Wally's Or a Guy who Owns a Full blown Machine shop than some Key Board commandos on some web forum.
    I have a no "ignore" policy as being an adult I learn to deal with people in proper ways instead of burying my head in the Dirt. I find the only ones here calling for mods, and claiming to be victims are the ones who are being proven wrong by actual evidence, logical thought out data driven ideas. Typically the losing team does call the referee more often..

    I will mention everything you listed, your are 100% guilty yourself of. Specially where you have not provided any data driven proof to back up the claims of crank splash being the cure.
    2011 Dodge Charger Pursuit 113K Miles. Stock for Now.
    Cop Brakes, Cop Exhaust, Cop Suspension,
    It's the model with the big bull bar so pedestrians get out of the way.

    Likes GTSDart340 liked this post

  14. #149
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Posts
    1,380
    Post Thanks / Like
    So let me ask you this then? Why does that block , and I say that block because it’s based on the 5.7 and 6.4’s have so many problems with lifters and cams?


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  15. #150
    Join Date
    Feb 2018
    Location
    Chattanooga TN
    Posts
    61
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by Renfrick1 View Post
    So let me ask you this then? Why does that block , and I say that block because it’s based on the 5.7 and 6.4’s have so many problems with lifters and cams?


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

    Why does only some of them have issues and not all of them?

    Why is it that no 3 and No 5 cylinders seem to be common?

    Why is it that MDS and Non MDS lifters can fail in other random places beyond the two fore mention cylinders?

    Why is it that within a year range in the 2010-2013 seem to be the worst years for lifter failures compared to other years?

    Why does the fail parts not show excessively heat in the metal?


    If you can answer all of these and they all point to the same conclusion, then you will have an answer. Prolonged Idling, and "splash lubrication" is a flawed ideal that ignores many other factors. A design Flaw would effect everything built to said design. A Defect effects a number of parts within a range of time/miles/wear/use.
    2011 Dodge Charger Pursuit 113K Miles. Stock for Now.
    Cop Brakes, Cop Exhaust, Cop Suspension,
    It's the model with the big bull bar so pedestrians get out of the way.

    Likes GTSDart340 liked this post



Page 10 of 10 FirstFirst ... 8910

Tags for this Thread

Share This Thread

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •